We are playing a game of at least 6 players at my place december the 28th.

This is in for playtest.

OK, so:




Addition to the Rulebook:
--
30.14 Diaspora (Religion - 270)
30.14.1 Provides 10 Religion credits and 5 Art credits.
30.14.2 During the Special Abilities Phase (25.2), a holder may place up to seven unit points from stock in one or several empty areas, provided that an unblocked path can be traced to target areas.
The number of tokens placed this way may not exceed the population limit of an area, regardless of the holding Agriculture. Cities built this way can only be built on a city site.
30.14.3 A holder's hand limit of trade cards is reduced by one. (27.2.2)
--

(In fact, I think the Agriculture part is clear from the card, but players who have doubts should not leave it to chance after checking it in the rulebook.)

So, if you hold Agriculture, and you place tokens in an area with a population limit of 3, you can only place 3 tokens, not 4.
(people might move there, butdo not immediatley have an agricultural extend)

Now, when I look at the card, it seems a great card to me, worth its 270 points.

Every turn after calamity resolution, there might be areas empty.
Now you can place tokens in 4 areas giving you an additional 7 tokens next turn.

a lot better than monotheism, because you don't directly affect other players. Combined with Cultural ascendancy this can get very tricky.

You might also move a ship to an foreign area and fight until the area is empty. then in the special abilities phase, fill it up with new population.

Still this card reflects its historical meaning. People moving is masses from their original homelands to another 'empty' land, where other people might say 'this is my land'.
The 'unblocked path' part is very essential in this.

So this token should come from the board a not from stock!

Well actually you are right, but it would make the card less powerful.

consider a turn to be 250 years, we could say these people expand in the new area.

I agree for this price... but for 150 it would be ok...
but no need to change it further.. it was just an idea.

you're right. but for 150 we have universal doctrine in the same range of cards, or maybe agriculture or architecture can be seen as a cheap sort of diaspora like you described.

I have one addition:

For now we agreed to this:



In the current (previous) version of Diaspora, you could pick one area you could reach by sea.
Now when you can pick several areas, you can 'scan' all areas over open sea areas for empties. This might make the card very powerful. I guess it's something we did not notice yet.

For example, when you play Dravidia, you can pick almost any area on the East map. but more important, you can pick one area at the nubia coast, one area at the persia coast, one area at the maurya coast.

So I think, an additonial limitation should be made.

My proposal:





Addition to the Rulebook:
--
30.14 Diaspora (Religion - 270)
30.14.1 Provides 10 Religion credits and 5 Art credits.
30.14.2 During the Special Abilities Phase (25.2), a holder may place up to seven unit points from stock into one or several empty areas, provided that an unblocked path can be traced to target areas. These seven unit points may consist of a city and tokens. For each area the number of tokens may not exceed its population limit, regardless of holding Agriculture (30.3). If more than one area is chosen this way, all chosen area must be adjacent to eachother. A city built this way can only be built on a city site, and no additional tokens can be placed in the same area this way.
30.14.3 A holder's hand limit of trade cards is reduced by one. (27.2.2)
--

Agreed.

Good point, but also is said:I believe in these 250 years people are able to develop agricultural extend...
Anyway, the tokens already are removed from stock, but during the conflict -, the remove surplus - or the calamity phase.

But when a diaspora can be used right, the holder can place seven units on the board, and then in the next population expansion phase this number becomes 14. I think this is too much. Maybe we can limit the number of areas to 2 adjacent areas? Then you just can place your city and support, but not place something which is as powerful as two cities of which one already supported.

Considering it is only really fesable to have hae diaspora for 2-4 turns (if that) I'm not too concerned. The card needs to have a good payout to deserve the price. A person might always get unlucky and never be able to use the full (or even partial) benifit.

What I meant, is:

Rulewise, it shouldn't be allowed to place that extra token, for that might be too powerful.
Historically it could be reasonable, but as our game has many historical errors, this could be accepted. It only tried to give some sort of 'historical interpretation' to justify the rule. (worth nothing , just to illustrate)

The same for 'so the tokens used for Diaspora should come from the board rather than stock.' which would be too weak for 270.

In the first place:
I'm looking to make the card be well balanced, powerful for 270, but not TOO powerful for the game.

In the second place:
It should be somehow historically right.

So, that's why I tried to hold stick to the original concept, rather than your idea for a whole new concept somewhere earlier in this topic.

I liked Velusion's idea, so we worked it out and tried to balance it.



Are you talking about the limit of "maximum 2 adjacent area's" only, or do you mean you are not concerned enough to add "adjacent" in the first place.

I have another question about Diaspora (and actually the same about Universal Doctrine): Is the path free when one of the areas used in the path is a sea area bordering a land area containing enemy units?
If so, it it still free when enemy ships are present on the said area?

Good thing you've noticed this, I was thinking about this subjecct myself once.

To all know what we are talking about
This is what the (Current) rulebook says:







So, tracing a path is allowed over over sea areas, as it is not denied and 'open sea area' are considered an 'area'.

Water and land components in the same area are considered two different areas for this purpose. So when tracing a path, you may trace over the sea part of an area, considering the land part as a different area.

As ships are not considered units, there is no possible unit that can exist in the sea parts of areas, nor at open sea areas.


To clearify this, maybe an addition should be made whenever speaking of 'tracing paths' ships are not counted in.

Not on the card, but in the rulebook.

Maybe this will do:



(I also changed 'tracing these paths' to 'tracing a path' as you are only tracing a single path.

Then, now we are taking a closer look. I hightligted 'completely empty area' for Diaspora.
Regarding 'Water and land components in the same area are considered two different areas for this purpose', you are allowed to fill up the land part of a(combined) area where the sea part is containing a ship (as these are considered two different areas for this purpose)

I don't know if this is the way it was intented. If so, maybe this should be clearified to take away any doubts in this.

I'm thinking about



If not, it should be:



This is a question to Velusion

I've created illustrations to visualize things. (maybe images like these should be included in the rulebook)








No it is no coincedence i'm taking the map of the netherlands for this illustrations.

As it is extremely difficult if not impossible to remove an opponents boats from the board I think boats should always be ignored when tracing a path. Only unit and city tokens should be able to block a path.

Otherwise, when my opponent buys diaspora I will camp boats at strategic points along his/her coast.

DG.

Oh yeah, that's what I meant as well, just like is described in the rulebook.

All I've done is explaining things.

Shouldn't it be sufficient to state: "areas without enemy units" instead of
"completely empty areas". As Ships are no Units, it is waterproof specified.

By the way... at many different places the Rulebook should be enhanced by Pictures of Game Situations.